The historicity of Rama- should it really matter?

Written by  //  October 24, 2010  //  Philosophy, Religion, Culture  //  13 Comments

Speculation about the historicity of Rama is a flourishing industry in India. Some are convinced that there was a historical Rama and confidently point out with remarkable accuracy, to within a few square inches, the exact spot of his birth. Others file affidavits in the court denying that there was ever a Rama who walked the earth. Some read the recent judgment of the Allahabad High court as vindicating the historicity of Rama: I wonder though how any competent user of the English language could give such an interpretation to Agarwal J’s judgment. The Rama asserters get terribly annoyed with the Rama deniers and vice versa. In the midst of the cacophony of assertions and denials, it is easy to lose sight of one fundamental question- why should anyone professing to be a “Hindu” bother about any of this?

The question is- should the historicity of Rama matter to someone taking himself to be a Hindu? Of course I am painfully aware of how this question has in fact mattered in the past to some Hindus. Had it not mattered to some of them, they wouldn’t have been moved to demolishing a mosque standing at a place, they believed to be Ramjanmabhoomi. There are many Hindus to whom it the historicity of Rama matters, though they would not in the least approve of the demolition of the mosque. But my question is this – Should it matter to any Hindu whether Rama was a historical figure? This question subsumes some cognate ones. If it were to turn out that the historicity of Rama shouldn’t matter, it also shouldn’t matter whether they get his birthplace right and have a temple for him there. I am here inviting you to a discussion at the end of which we would have hopefully made the question of the historicity of Rama redundant. That will tell us how the Ramjanmabhoomi issue could be made redundant.

There is a general lack of awareness, let alone proper understanding, amongst Hindus of what Hinduism is all about. It is too much to expect the layman to have read the Upanishads. The Bhagavad Gita is the closest that one gets to an authoritative and somewhat comprehensive summary of the Upanishadic philosophy.  In a typical kirana (grocer’s) shop, you will find above the till (galla), somewhere between the biscuit shelf and the peanut jar, a nail with a calendar hanging from it containing a Gita Saar ( a summary of the Bhagavad Gita) in not more than 10 bullet points.   I can wager an arm and a leg that even Krishna cannot come up with a 10 point summary of the Bhagavad Gita – a complex many layered philosophical work – with a modicum of sense or coherence. Unfortunately the knowledge of many Hindus of the Bhagavad Gita, or at any rate of those who lose their night’s sleep over the historicity of Rama, is worse than what can be had from the one page Gita Saar.

Had they ( the one’s to whom the historicity of Rama matters) bothered to inquire why should Rama matter in the first place, they could have consulted the Bhagavad Gita and turned to chapter XII on Bhakti Yoga (path of devotion); after all isn’t it out of bhakti (devotion) that the need to worship Rama and the need for a Rama temple is felt?  Why should Rama matter if not for Bhakti? But what is Bhakti or devotion and what does it entail?  Some context of the structure of the Gita is important to appreciate this.  The point of the Bhagavad Gita is to suggest tentative paths to ‘yoga’ (union) for the individual consciousness (ego) to rid itself of its shackles of samsara and restore it to its ever abiding true state of Brahman. The central message of the Gita is that Yoga can be complete only when the ego is quelled. As Ramana Maharishi points out ‘yoga’ is ceasing to think that you are an individual ego separate from reality. All the major paths of knowledge(jnana), devotion(bhakti) and action(karma), discussed in the Gita are all meant to achieve the very same end, namely to quell the ego. This must be read in the background of the overarching concept of maya- according to which all manifestation is an illusion. In short anything perceived as real is illusionary. Let me tell you something that follows straightaway from this. If there were figures such as Rama and Kirshna in human form, they were just as much a product of maya as anything else phenomenal in the universe.

The idea of a diety or god like Rama or Krishna is relevant only for someone who takes the Bhakti marga (the path of devotion). Someone walking on the Jnana marga doesn’t need Krishna or Rama and could very well be an atheist. Let us forget Janana marga and focus on Bhakti marga alone. As Krishna says, the goal of path of devotion or bhakti is to surrender the self completely to the imperishable,indefinable,unmanifest,the omnipresent, unthinkable’ Brahman. But Krishna recognizes that the path of knowledge is a particularly difficult one because it is difficult to set one’s mind on the unmanifested and unthinkable. As an alternative he suggests treating HIM as a placeholder or symbol for the unthinkable, ineffable Brahman and by worshipping HIM, effacing the ego. As Ramanuja sums up Bhakti is “Joining the mind with devotion to that which is not Brahman, taking it to be Brahman”. Verily worship is the process of the distinction between the thinker and thought (god) merging. Eventually even the god is a mental idea and the thought of the god has also to disappear for there to be yoga or realization. These so called ‘gods’ are mere postulates, fictions and place holders for the ultimate Brahman (truth). They are, to use a popular Vedantic and Buddhist analogy, rafts for crossing the river of samsara and are to be abandoned when on the other side. Further to what I said earlier I would add, Rama and Krishna are relevant only for Bhakti. But for Bhakti, they wouldn’t be needed. If not for Bhakti why does a Hindu need Rama?

This is what Swami Vivekananda has to say about Bhakti Yoga:

“One thing, therefore, has to be carefully borne in mind. If, as it may happen in some cases, the highly philosophic ideal, the supreme Brahman, is dragged down by Pratika–worship ( worship of a god with a form) to the level of the Pratika, and the Pratika itself is taken to be the Atman…the worshipper gets entirely misled, as no Pratika can really be the Atman… But where Brahman Himself is the object of worship, and the Pratika stands only as a substitute or a suggestion thereof, that is to say, where, through the Pratika the omnipresent Brahman is worshipped”

Rama, Krishna and all other so called ‘gods’, are symbols of the ineffable, ultimate truth. They should not be confused with the truth itself as Vivekananda says. Whether these were also ‘real’ men or not is hopelessly irrelevant. If they were men they were as much a play of maya as anything phenomenal; and truth is the dissolution of maya. Thus real worship would entail treating these men Rama and Krishna like any other object of maya. Their being historic men adds no value to their symbolism. They may or may not have been living human beings. But their function as symbols has nothing to do with their historicity.

Finding out where they were born is silly. And thinking that they can be worshipped only at that place is bordering the insane. And to think that goal must be achieved at any cost, is definitely insane. Worship is nothing but surrendering the ego. How is that purpose furthered in any way by establishing where a symbol is born and have a temple at a specific place for the symbol? I recognize the importance of temples and rituals and all of that in the bhakti marga, but the historicity of any god is never of any relevance. For a Hindu, or at any rate, one who is interested in ‘Yoga’ the Ramajanmabhoomi issue would be nothing but a silly distraction.

Anticipating an objection

I feel compelled to anticipate and meet before hand one kind of objection to what I have said here. It could be objected – This is your interpretation of Hinduism; but different people have different interpretations; how do you know yours is the right one? I am aware of similar debates surrounding the interpretation of scriptures of other religions.

To the objector I have only one thing to say. Please give me your interpretation and do nothing more than name the scripture you base your interpretation on. In case of most “interpretations” of Hinduism it turns out that people form opinions out of folk concepts, without ever having bothered to read any scripture. In other words they turn out to be ‘superstitions’ and not interpretations at all.  The best example of this is the concept of Karma the popular understanding of which is the exact opposite of what Krishna says in the Gita. Then the dispute here would between an interpretation and a mere superstition or pop conception. An objector basing his objection on such superstition would not be disagreeing with me but altogether talking past me.

13 Comments on "The historicity of Rama- should it really matter?"

  1. Alok October 25, 2010 at 1:12 pm ·

    I agree with you generally, but there’s a problem with your last part.

    Unlike the Book religions, no one Hindu book claims to be “sole” description of the Truth, to the exclusion of others. There are Brahmins who follow the Sama Veda to the exclusion of the Yajur Veda (and vice versa) without denying the truth of the other, and continuing to be Hindus. Is the Mahabharatha a more “religious” text than the Vedas or the Ramayana over the Upanishads? It is impossible to say. Textual authority, at least in matters of the Hindu faith, does not count in the same manner as say, the Bible, the Quran or the Torah.

    That said, one could legitimately argue that pilgrimage is also an essential part of worship. For instance, in the Mahabharata itself, the Pandavas undertake two separate pilgrimages at different stages of their lives, visiting the holy places of their time (I’ll try and give a list sometime), not just on a whim, but for their spiritual nourishment. In such a context, identification of spiritual place (perhaps they didn’t need an ASI when they had Ved Vyasa himself ;)) is all important and not just a matter of superstition.

  2. Arghya October 25, 2010 at 1:13 pm ·

    Shiv, wonderful post and a thoroughly enjoyable read. I agree entirely that the birthplace of Rama is a distraction from the beautiful philosophy of the bhakti yoga. But I have a logical objection to the extrapolated point that the historicity of Rama or any other symbol of Brahman, as you put it, is irrelevant. Let me preface my objection by saying that it is purely a logical objection, and not something I believe in. I believe, much like you do, that their historicity should be irrelevant.
    But anyhow, to my objection. I was wondering what makes one a symbol of Brahman? Why is it that Krishna or Rama can be symbols of Brahman? Is it because things they have done/ said or is it because of who they are? Let’s tackle this question from another angle- what about a clearly historical person like say Ramakrishna or Chaitanya being a symbol? Or alternatively, even a common person like say someone’s mother or father etc.? If the purpose of a symbol is to facilitate reaching Brahman given the difficult task of surrendering to an unknown, formless entity, then surely that symbol can be anyone who ONE believes will allow one to reach Brahman. So it could, in principle, be anyone at any time or at any place.
    Now the reason it strikes me that Rama and Krishna are powerful symbols, and I do agree with you that they are, is because of the fact that they are widely believed to have stood for/ had and done certain things which people look upon as godly. And once this becomes the basis for the belief, automatically their historicity becomes important. What they did, where they did it, how did they do it, what they said, all become part and parcel of the symbol that is created. I agree that the essence of the symbol is their message meditating upon which human beings may move towards the ultimate truth. But their historicity is intrinsically tied to this message, and will naturally be seen as sacred and revered for those who believe in them as symbols of Brahman.
    So in short, I don’t think historicity IS as irrelevant as you make it out to be though I agree with you that it should be.

  3. Shivprasad October 26, 2010 at 6:46 pm ·


    I agree with you about the multiplity of sciptures and sacred texts in Hinduism. And I also agree that the Mahabharata and Ramayana are considered sacred by many. Yet I dont think any of that cuts against my argument. And here is why I think it doesnt;

    Ramayana and the Mahabharata are not , to use a somewhat teachnical term- because none else fits the bill- ‘deontic’ or ‘practical’. They do not prescribe what is to be done or or not done. They are legends( whether true or not). There is a perception that unlike these legends the Shruti’s and Smriti’s are practical or deontic. For instance the Bhagavad Gita which is taken to be an Upanishad is widely believed to be a practical guide requiring some form of action or the other. I doubt though whether even the Bhagavad Gita is a practical guide. Reference can be made to Aldoux Huxley’s brilliant essay on the Bhagavad Gita in “Song of God” arguing that the Gita does not prescribe anything. In any case, the Ramayana and the Mahabharata are defninitely not practical , regardless of what you may think about the Gita.

    I am aware of a practice amongst Brahmins to align themselves to ‘shakhas’. However this was a distinction made to preserve the vedas. Brahmins of some branch are meant to preserve the sound of some vedas. From this I dont think that you can conclude they follow different vedas. In fact vedas are divided into karma kanda(rituals) and jnana kanda(philosophy). The karma kanda prescribes several different yajnas and practices. To that extent I agree that brahmins follow different vedas. However when it comes to the jnana kanda , I do not think there is anything different in the different vedas to follow. In fact if you pick up any of the principal upanishads, which are meant to be expositions of the janan kanda of the vedas you will find that they are identical in spirit and offer very little or no practical advise.
    Finally , there are clear rules of conflict resolution amongst scriptures. The Shuti’s ie.e. the vedas overrule everything else.

    But none of this has any bearing on my argument. Most people have not based thier opinions on any of these scriptures. My argument is that had they done so and understood thier ow religion better, they would not bother about the historicity of Rama. If any one based on any interpretation of any scripture says that the historicity of Rama should matter, I am willing to tolerate that view, though it may differ from myinterpretation. But here there is no rival interpretation competing with mine. Rather there is a superstitution competing with a plausible interpretation.

    2.Of course pilgrimage is an essential component of bhakti yoga. But from that it cannot be inferred that the birth place of some god must be the place where this must be done. Interestingly if you look back in history to the traditional pilgrimage spots, for instance if you follow Shnkara’ pilgrimage ( 5-8thcentury AD) you will find mention of Rameshawaram , Kashi, Badrinath, Nasik etc… but there is no mention to be found of Ayodhya or Mathura ( the claimed birthplaces of Rama and Kirshna). In fact to my knowledge the padavas never made a pilgraimge to Ayodhya, though they were in time much after the Ramayana. The scaredness of all these spots like Kashi ,Rameshwaram etc was for reasons other than the birth of some god. I hoope that explains why even the pilgrimage argument does not support the case for a Ram temple in Ayodhya just because ram is believed to be born there.

  4. Mahesh May 25, 2011 at 12:24 pm ·


    It seems you are inclined to ‘Advaitha’ school of thought & try to undermine anything related to ‘Vaishnava’ philosophy as we go through your post & the replies on the comment of others… Just because ‘Shankara’ or ‘Pandavas didn’t visit the place of Ayodhya doesn’t make it less relevant to the Ram Bhakts or other devotees of ‘Vaishnava’ school of thought. As a matter of fact there is no proof as such as something called ‘Brahman’ or ‘Atman’ as claimed by the ‘Vedas’ & the ‘Shrutis’ are irrelevant when coming to the point of providing any proofs based on scientific experiments & research. If at all there is a ‘God’ & it is the creator of everything, it is foolish to argue that it cannot manifest itself well in to this material nature & come in to existence in a human form… If the argument that ‘Brahman’, ‘Atman’ & ‘Prakriti’ have been ever existing, the whole point of praying or even thinking about the ‘Brahman’ becomes totally irrelevant, & Vedas go to the bin because our existence is not bound by the ‘Brahman’ & the way to find absolutely knowledge, happiness & bliss is by ourselves & not bothering about ‘Brahman’ because both are independent & ever existing…

    But the point you are missing completely here is, there existed one beautiful structure(temple of Ram) @ Ayodhya being worshipped by some set of people(hindus) around 15th Century & before, & there came a barbaric set of people belonging to alien culture(Arab religious culture) from the ‘Indian sub-continent’ point of view & it almost erased the native culture from the northern plains of India replacing with the mosques & masoulems of the Peers/Babas & thatswhat matters to the common sense & logic of the people…

  5. VAMANAN October 5, 2011 at 7:22 pm ·

    I don’t think it is right to say that Ramayana and Mahabharata are not ‘practical’ , in the sense Shivprasad uses. Rama’s conduct, in fact, in following the boon given by his father to his stepmother underscores the importance of keeping promises. Rama is to be taken as a role model. Hundreds of verses of the Ramayana brim with intimations to us about the high values we must cherish. Kausalya, for example, is convinced by Rama about the rightness of his going to the forest to keep his father’s promise…She blesses him saying, ”May the righteousness (dharma) that you follow with such resoluteness, may it guard you on your path”. A famous Tamil poet (Namakkal Ramalingam Pillai) once thought of the Ramayana as a commentary on the maxims of Tirukkural (anachronism apart). You see Hindus all over India believe that Rama lived and trod on the sacred earth of the country…there may be one Ayodhya, but there are thousands and thousands of temples and pilgrim centres which in some way or other connect themselves to Rama’s story. The great linga in the Rameswaram shrine, Ramanathaswamy, is believed to have been the spot where Rama worshipped Shiva to rid himself of the sin of killing Ravana, a Brahmin. Thirupullani, near Ramanathapuram is said to be the place where Rama lay on kusa grass for three days for invoking divine help to cross the sea. etc etc…You see even the tellings of the lives of so-called historical personalities is overlaid with layers and layers of myth. In the case of Hinduism, which is ancient, this problem becomes infinitely compounded. I have put this down not to get into argument…I believe mankind has reached that stage in history where all bigotry on religious matters is thoroughly to be eschewed…and no religion should be criticised on any account by anybody and no religion should claim monopoly of the truth.

  6. Justin February 18, 2013 at 6:39 am ·

    Whether it matters or not itself doesn’t matter! Who are we to not be genuinely curious as to historicity of said Rama regardless. It is a fascinating prospect and captures our imagination. It also adds weight to the profundity of the legend if indeed, Ram existed, not just as mere myth.
    We may never know, but it is part of what may lie as interesting and enjoyable for archeologists and historians nonetheless. If, in any aspect, it is part of what makes the legacy of Hinduism interesting, it is of some benefit.

  7. Shiva Shanakr August 12, 2013 at 8:15 am ·

    @ ShivaPrasad & Alok :

    We have Shruthis and Smruthis in sanathana dharma. Shruthi is “what heard” and Smrithi is “What remembered” .

    Vadas belongs to “Shruthi” (Heard ) and Ramyana and Mahabaratha are “Smruthi” (Remembered). Remembrance has two possibilities.

    1. You heard – you listen – you understand – you remember – you follow
    2. You see – You experience – you understand – you remember – you follow

    The great difference between other religions with Sanathana Dharma is. “Sanathana Dharama has a border view and path of God”. Coz, the liberation is thyself, hence, every individual has his/her own way and path of understanding the god. Which is why, sanathana dharma never ever produced/produces prophets and single holy text.

    Matter of fact, Liberation (MOKSHA) is not a formula to be understood and attained through text. It is experience only.

    @ Mahesh:

    You might be from any school of thought. We should respect all school and scholars. If “Sankara” was not aware of “Rama” (Vishnu), he would have written “Bhaja shiva Bhaja shiva” instead “Bhaja govindam “ and couldn’t complete of the Vishnu sahasranama by authoring of its 108th verse.

    For your reference, read Uddava Geetha, the last message from lord Krishna. You understand, Krishna is “Dualist” or “non Dualist”

    For any clarifications, please feel free to write

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